Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 07:23:04 GMT Message-ID: <3ddc88d0.5015122@news.earthlink.net> Newsgroups: rec.games.computer.doom.editing,alt.games.doom From: (SEE_SIG_BELOW)_balanco01@no$pam@yah_nothanks@oo.c@o.hm (Cacodemon) Subject: Very odd editing questions regarding the size of Doom's level area 1) I was wondering foir a long time now if it was possible to have a level that is built at the very edge of the map space (where the level wraps around and begins to repeat when noclipping and moving in a straight line through nul space) which crosses that boundry. If someone was to build a level located at such extreme coordenents, would there be any strange effects or "artifacts" at the location, simaler to what you see when you no clip far enough out side of the level? 2) If the level or an individual sector happened to cross this boundry (lets say the west side of the level is at X:30000, and the east side was at X:-30000, without any gaps between the two sides of the level), would this too produce any strange effects, or mess up the look of the level? 3) Is it possible to have one very long sector that wraps around to the point that the end is overlapping the beginning. If so, what kind of effect would this produce? Would look simaler to having two independent sectors over lapping eachother (you would have an "invisible" wall right before the end of the sector, and no-clipping into where the over lap shows you a small enclosed "room" which is as big as the overlap. *** Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 23:34:30 +0000 (UTC) Message-ID: Newsgroups: rec.games.computer.doom.editing From: Andre Majorel Subject: Re: Very odd editing questions regarding the size of Doom's level area In article , Andre Majorel wrote: > In article <3ddc88d0.5015122@news.earthlink.net>, Cacodemon wrote: > >> 1) I was wondering foir a long time now if it was possible to have >> a level that is built at the very edge of the map space (where the >> level wraps around and begins to repeat when noclipping and >> moving in a straight line through nul space) which crosses >> that boundry. If someone was to build a level located at >> such extreme coordenents, would there be any strange >> effects or "artifacts" at the location, simaler to what >> you see when you no clip far enough out side of the level? > > The first problem is to create such a level. Nodes builders > might get confused. That could probably be worked around by > making a level at normal coordinates, building the nodes, and > *then* translating it off the edge of the world. Here's a 1024x1024 level made that way (x += 32768) with a hacked version of mergewad.pl : http://www.teaser.fr/~amajorel/doom/wrap1.wad Tested with XDoom (PrBoom segfaults on it). Contrary to my expectations, a former human does follow you around. But it won't fire at you unless you're both on the same side of the seam. There are a few minor visual glitches. You can pass through some walls, perhaps because of the blockmap errors. The automap won't draw (not even the grid). > If monsters and player are not on the same side of the "seam", I > would expect the monsters to look like to turn their back on the > player and walk away from it instead of chasing it. Can anyone explain why the FH follows you ? Even if the calculations are done on 32-bit integers, those must be initialised from the 16-bit values in the wad and, as the player X coordinate in this wad is > 0 and the FH X coordinate is < 0, the FH should move eastwards, not westwards. > The wraparound is likely to have very strange effects on the > level itself. Blockmap calculations will be off, I guess, > possibly causing crashes at the north and south edges. I'd be > suprised if the engine could even properly draw linedefs and > flats across the seam. Consider me thoroughly surprised. *** Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 04:08:13 GMT Message-ID: <3dddabae.872266@news.earthlink.net> Newsgroups: rec.games.computer.doom.editing From: (SEE_SIG_BELOW)_balanco01@no$pam@yah_nothanks@oo.c@o.hm (Cacodemon) Subject: Re: Very odd editing questions regarding the size of Doom's level area >Tested with XDoom (PrBoom segfaults on it). Contrary to my >expectations, a former human does follow you around. But it >won't fire at you unless you're both on the same side of the >seam. There are a few minor visual glitches. You can pass One time, I created a single sector that was about as large as the "nul space" area, and tested it out with Boom, and I did get those weird walls appearing out of nowhere errors within the sectors, simaler when you get close to the "seam". Is this what you were getting? *** Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 01:41:50 -0600 Message-ID: Newsgroups: rec.games.computer.doom.editing From: "Tim Williams" Subject: Re: Very odd editing questions regarding the size of Doom's level area Cool... Works in vanilla Doom BTW. :)) *** Date: Sat, 23 Nov 2002 05:11:50 GMT Message-ID: <3ddf0b9c.2049277@news.earthlink.net> Newsgroups: rec.games.computer.doom.editing From: (SEE_SIG_BELOW)_balanco01@no$pam@yah_nothanks@oo.c@o.hm (Cacodemon) Subject: Re: Very odd editing questions regarding the size of Doom's level area I tried it out with the DOS Eternity source port, and the game immeditaely crashed when the zombie in front of me woke up. Both the DOS and Windows version of Zdoom (both 1.17c) had no problems like this. Two interesting points: 1) the wall with the light, and the one opposite of it are intangable, but still stop bullets. Rocket launchers and plasma rifles were unaffected 2) When I no clipped through the solid walls, and kept going, I got those same "walls out of nowhere" effect, like you typicaly do while you are at the "seam" where this level is located at, when I halfway between this sector, and the "repeat copy" (for lack of better words.) Basicly, I was getting this effect while I was standing where a level would normaly be.